tail docking

[Dan McK]

Question is why does a working dog need it docked?

Different breeds should have been docked differently. My older Parsons where docked to leave around 6" of tail left so that there was a hand hold left. However the breeder that I just bought young Tess from (who is 1st generation with tail undocked), the vet he used docked them and only left about 2". When asked to leave a wee bit more his reaction was 'thats the way I do it, if you want it done then its done like that!'. I think this attitude only reinforces the argument for banning the practice.

Incidentally, even after such a short time the snobbery has kicked in, and the discussion between some Parson's breeders is how to breed a dog with a straight tail, while others are putting the importance on a strong tail.
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Parsons Russell fanatic

[marcella]

[Lindy]

Can't stand breed snobbery! supposedly Dora being so black would not be classed as a JRT by the terriers club although both her parents are JRT's sooo silly. On the tail docking thing for working dogs such as spaniels, Labs and some terriers they need docked tails to stop any damage occuring and consequently having to be amputated, many of these working breeds have to go through gorse, rohdies, and other sharp undergrowth that can damage their tails supposedly the op to amputate is much more complicated and sore for the dog so this is one reason why working dogs need this done.

[Susan]

[kendal]

hounds tend to be short hared so they don't have feathering on the tale like the spaniel.
from what i have seen of spaniels with tails is that they carry them low down unlike the hounds who carry them high up, which i guess is why they are more likely to get damaged if the feathering got tangled in the undergrowth.

labs and retrievers don't get docked.
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[Lindy]

Kendal you are right Labs don't get docked I wasn't paying attention to what I was writing. I
Susan I had asked the question as to why tails get docked and that was the answer I got, for some dogs I can see the reasoning but for others such as boxers, rotties etc I don't see the need and recon that you are right it is just for show. I have been hearing about breeders who breed show dogs now not breeding because they can't dock

[kendal]

i would guess that it was to make them more aversive looking as a rotties tail curls up along like keano and coby. that breed is used as a Gard dog if you see a waggy tail you think its not that bad(that is i you have a rugh idea how to read a dog ).
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[brenda]

Kaiser has dew claws.The vet recommended us to get them removed. But they don't bother him if they do i will get them removed.
All Northen inuit have them.
Brenda.

[Deborah Hamilton]

[carol]

2 of my dogs have docked tails. Both dogs are loving pets first and fore most however.....

The Schnauzer aged 13 / 14 is a rescue and his tail was already docked when we got him. This was obviously for cosmetic/ breed standard reasons because there is no obvious reason why he needed his tail removed. In my opinion it was total unnecessary.

The other dog is my Parson Terrier, who is now 6 years old, she is first and foremost a family member
and her hobby is agility. I got Jilly from showing/ breed lines and I know her pedigree, I don't allow her to hunt or chase animals, however these little dogs genes tell them they are hunting dogs regardless of what our reasons for keeping them as pets are. Jilly had her tail dock (now 4 inches long) and her dew claws removed when she was days old, when the bone was very soft, I don't know what level of pain that caused, I was told at that age it was similar to clipping older dogs nails, I don't know. What I do know is that that if her tail had not been docked,she would have more that likely broken it when she got stuck under a large wooden workshop after chasing a mouse. Thank fully she didn't catch the mouse but her instincts told her to chase it and she did with total determination to catch it. It resulted in her being stuck under the workshop for over 5 hours, during that time she made every effort to release herself but could not, including digging into the ground, she was worn out thought sheer exhaustion and stress. We eventually managed to grab her tail and get her out. Had it been long it would have been undoubtedly broken and we would not have been able to use it to pull her to safety or cause her excruciating pain in doing so.

So I am sort of mixed on the subject, spaniels, rottie, schauzer etc have beautiful tails and I cant see any real reason they need them docked.

However, these wee terriers have hunting in their genes and they can get their self into all sorts of mischief including down rabbit holes etc, which can collapse on them or they can get stuck, some times their tails is the only mean of getting them out safely.

I also lost Jilly down a fox warren, for over an hour, again that was just a walk in the Forrest, one minute she was at my side the next vanished.
These two incident happened to me and I am set again any type hunting. Small hunting breeds can and do get their self into bother.
So as much as I against docking, I can see for some breeds it could be their life saver!

Below, my Parson Terrier, Jilly

Im sorry this pict is really big, not sure how to make it small perhaps john can work some magic on it.

[Janis]

BIG PICTURE BUT GORGEOUS FACE!

JILLY LOOKS SO FOCUSED AND INTERESTED IN WHAT SHE IS WATCHING! GREAT SHOT! EVERY HAIR AND WHISKER DETAIL IS SHARP!

WELL DONE ! I'D HAVE THIS PHOTO FRAMED!

[Lindy]

Carol she is beautiful, I have two JRT's and just love them and Parsons I know exactly what you mean about the hunting instinct many of the forum members have seen Dora my 2 yr old JRT in action she has shot off like a bullet twice ion the glen to chase rabbits and John and I had a right carry on trying to get a hold of her, she too has been found down a rabbit hole and we pulled her pulled her out by her full tail and I can see the reasoning behind docking for such dogs, in turn there are places now she just does not get off as her instinct is much stronger than her loyalty to me and she will ignore me completely and I don't want to lose her or for her to get hurt.

[marcella]

Carol, she's a beautiful dog!

As for Dora the Explorer .............. I've seen her vanish on walk after picking up a scent and there's nothing you can do about it. It IS in their genes. Murphy will go off when he picks up a scent (although he's a bit chunky to get down a rabbit warren!!!! ) but he chases rabbits, foxes, deer, squirrels and his personal favourite ................. Magpies. Diesel doesn't bother he doesn't have that same prey drive.

JRT's and Parsons etc can get themselves into the smallest of spaces

[Suzanne H]

Otto is hilarious...from start of walk to end, it's nose to ground following wavy scent paths. Now and again he remembers we're there and runs up for a play, or he bounds about in long grass for fun. But mostly it's "ooh, what's this, where's it gone, must find it."

[carol]